The Old Testament Heritage to New Testament Faith...

FB posting 6.26.10

I saw this in a Christian discussion on R. Crumb's graphic novel of GENESIS...
"As far as I am concerned, the OT does not truly offer anything of substance. Jesus claimed to have fulfilled the OT and to me that means rendering it obsolete. Genocide, rape, incest, monarchs, and God’s wrath have NOTHING to do with Jesus. I guess it could be used as an “or else” scare tactic, as in if Jesus had not died on the cross, this is what the world would be like. That, though, sounds like sinners in the hands of an angry God stuff and that has only destroyed people’s faith."

My response...
Genocide, rape, incest, monarchs and God’s wrath have EVERYTHING to do with Jesus. It was the History which led up to Him and that He enveleped into Himself. Jesus died on the cross and this is what the world IS like. Jesus was not ashamed to call The Old Testament YHWH “Abba” and if we are, the fault is in ourselves, not in YHWH. The worst fault in ourselves- to count ourselves as more civilized & holier than YHWH. Fulfilling the OT does not make it obsolete, it makes it more relevant than ever. It is the reality that most of the non-Christianized world and much of the Christianized world deals with every day. The OT gives us life as it is; The NT as it should be & can become, and even the NT Possible Ideal World is not the CandyLand we’d like it to be- it’s a World whose Constitution is engraved into the Torn Flesh & Shed Blood of Jesus and energized with the Fire of the Holy Spirit, Which is the Same GodFire which kindles Gehenna.

My friend Mark C challenges- Can't respond fully right now, only with a question to stir the pot. Why does YHWH of the Hebrew Bible often appear as the out of control step-child who requires theological gymnastics in order to explain away the parts we find offensive?

Me- Ooo! Good question! I think He appears that way to us because we have let the Gracious Merciful image of the Father given to us by Jesus domesticate us too much. Jesus knew the Hebrew Bible backward & forward & never hesitated to call that wild raging bloody God "Abba". Now, it's a good thing for the most part that we've become so skittish, but then again, we're skittish about birthin' our own babies, slaugherin' our own meat, preparin' our own dead- all the core experiences of life & death. And we are both blessed and cursed to live in a society that allows such skittishness (O brave new world!)- a great part of humanity still live in a Savage Reservation in which YHWH would seem a restrained & reasonable God.

My friend Tom A chimes in- Ced...ever think that God wanted us to take upon us the image and life of Jesus as opposed to the 'old testemant' blood & guts that you seem to love so much. Why did he not come out with a part three that combined or decided which he really prefers? Again I have to point out that while the Bible is inspired by God it is obviously written by imperfect MEN...no women and also some books decided in some out and I am not sure God decided that....but MEN...again no women.Again there are many in the world who are not the least bit skittish...they go about raping, killing and mutalating with little thought of mans or God's law. If you beleive that Christ is THE CHRIST then I think you have to give more importance to the New as opposed to the old....and as usual this is just my own damn opinion so you can't tell me I am WRONG! Ü But I would love to hear your opinion.

Mark C- Is our only way of addressing the violent God of the Hebrew Bible to throw our hands up in defeat and say that "God's ways are higher than our ways"? I remember that line from the C&MA and I still hear it once in a while in my own church, but it has never set well with me. I can't accept a God whose nature includes the slaughter of people for the sake of accomplishing a divine plan. I also can't understand the idea that God's holiness demands punishment. It seems to me that an omnipotent, omniscient God could easily craft a way that preserves human life. This is at the heart of the 20th century Christian malaise that has sent people looking elsewhere for place to practice a faith. I am constantly drawn back to the the two greatest commandments according to Jesus; love God and love neighbor. These sum up the Torah and it seems like this would be a better lense through which to struggle with Scripture. Just sayin.

Me- To Tom- Of course Christ-likeness is supposed to be our ultimate goal. Jesus is our model of Deity and of essential human kindness & fairness (I prefer those terms as being more practical & less open to distortion than "Love" and "Justice"). My Anglo-Israelism & Christian Reconstructionism aside, I certainly don't want to go back to the brutality of Old Testament days. Now, I do believe there are times for Just Wars & Capital Punishment - but for the most part, I believe that Peace & Rehabilitation should be our main goals. Btw, that also was the priority in the Old Testament- "Wrath" was described as God's "strange work"- a dirty job that sometimes had to be done. But as far as blood & guts, I only really like that in books & movies. Heck, I couldn't major in Psych as that required Biology courses with dissection! *L*Quick aside- the stories of Hagar, the mother of Ishmael, and Tamar, the daughter-in-law of Judah in Genesis, of Deborah and Jael in Judges, the books of Ruth & Esther, the Bridal part of the Song of Solomon, certain passages of Proverbs- all show a woman's touch and may actually have been essentially authored by the women in question. Same with the account of Mother Mary & family in Luke 1-2 and Mary Magdalene's meeting with the Risen Jesus in John 20. More later.... and Mark, I'll certainly get to your comments.

>Continuing my response to Tom- and this also addresses some of Mark's issues-The Old Testament of full of grace & forgiveness & inclusiveness- If it wasn't, all of the great Biblcal 'heroes' and all of Israel itself would have been incinerated. The only God-ordained "genocides" were of the child-sacrificing, sex-worshipping Canaanites and the ruthless Amalekites who had launched a genocidal campaign against Israel first- reprobate degenerates & homicidal maniacs who acted, not in ignorance of the Light, but it defiance of it. Canaan had once been God-honoring allies of Abraham. The Amalekites attacked Israel's weaker lagging areas, fully knowing that God has brought the people there out of Egypt. Other than those two groups, Israel was never told by God to conquer or eradicate anyone, but to either, as with the Philistines, defend themselves, honor God & live peacably with them when possible, or in the case of the Gentile Empires (Babylon-to-Rome), surrender to their rule, honor God, & live peacably & productively within the Empires. The ultimate goal of Israel, in the visions of the prophets, was a peaceful world where Israel was an example leading all nations to worship God and everyone had their own homes. raised families, & tended to their own gardens.

>OK now to your concerns, Mark- Even tho it's not "direct" either by Active Miraculous Smiting or a Divinely-Commanded Army, alas, somehow the deaths of people every day are part of the Divine plan- and that applies whatever religion one is. I've had Wiccans challenge my beliefs with "Why does your God allow this to happen?" when their Lord/Lady allows the very same thing. We just object when God seems to take a direct hand in those deaths and bunches them up, rather than letting Nature take care of it over time.
Now, He no longer seems to take Direct Smiting Action, I am glad to say, and when disasters happen to people, we should be front & center with aid & resources (which we really are), but I just don't see where we are allowed in the teachings of Jesus to repudiate the Old Testament as an account for how God indeed once had to deal with people. The OT is part of our spiritual heritage. Maybe it is part that we are now called to grow beyond, not because it was wrong, but because more is now expected of us, but it was still a God-ordained part of where we came from & still has lessons for us as to where we are.

As to "God's holiness demanding punishment"- it depends on what we mean by punishment. I do not believe in Hell as an Eternal Torture Chamber (or in my better turn of phrase- a Dante-esque Theme Park of Agony- feel free to use that). I do believe in Hades as a state of suspension & chastisement, even possible reconciliation, until the Resurrection, and in Gehenna/the Lake of Fire as being absorbed into the Divine Presence, either for a last chance at reconciliation, or extinquishing, or perhaps eternal travail for those who refuse reconciliation in the inescapable Divine Light. I do not know if God really made human souls to be immortal or not.

Yes, I believe the Two Laws of Loving God (specifically the Triune YHWH- not just any Higher Power) and Loving Neighbors are supreme, and are the Ground and the Goal of Torah. But we do an injustice when we substitute Torah-faithful Lovingkindness & Fairness with a skittish niceness that repudiates any unpleasantness.